sorry for the long span between posts. i was enjoying that discussion. i just had one or two things i wanted to add to place. i would love for us to find a place that was first used for a different purpose, and restore it and turn it into a church, or a new church, i love the metaphor of redemption in our building as well as our people. i would love to have a location near schools or in the middle of downtown, someplace people that are poor can walk. and i would love to have something of a greeting, either over the door or maybe in another way, something along the lines of "welcome all you sinners, tax collectors, prostitutes, adulterors, thieves, come and be redeemed," and that is very open to editing.
now, onto the topic i would like us to discuss in some more detail, the idea of excellence. all too often i feel like churches use the fact that they are working for god as an excuse to do some very subpar work. all too often it is used as an excuse to not plan ahead of time, to wait till the last minute, to put less energy into the work than we would with homework, or work for our jobs. i think that is pretty insulting to god. we have a much higher calling when we do work for the lord, therefore i think we shoudl put even more energy into it than we might with the things we do with less than eternal impact.
so i think it could help us to discuss several things; why do people so often not put their full effort into church work? why are they so apprehensive to plan ahead of time? and what can we gain by being very forward thinking? what are some ways we can encourage one another to do a better job, how can we help someone who is putting less than excellent effort into their work? it is very important that from the beginning we are honest with one another, but tactful at the same time, a lesson i am continually learning the hard way, but one that is necessary.
it was really great to have so many different voices respond to the last post, and it is ok if you just dont have something to say, but i want this to be all of our church, from the ground up, this is a place where we can share thoughts and ideas, so the more the merrier. anyway, keep us all updated, and lets really be praying that god brings us through our current ordeals with our eyes upon him. im excited every day about our future together. hope you guys are well.
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Pack some sweaters, we're going to Denver!
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Here We Go: All About the Snowy City of Denver, Colorado
The City and County of Denver is the capital and most populous city of the state of Colorado. Denver is located in the South Platte River Valley on the High Plains just east of the Front Range of the Southern Rocky Mountains. The Denver downtown district is located immediately east of the confluence of Cherry Creek with the South Platte River, approximately 15 miles (24 kilometers) east of the foothills of the Rocky Mountains. Denver is nicknamed The Mile-High City because its official elevation is exactly one mile (5,280 feet or approximately 1,609 meters) above sea level. The United States Census Bureau estimates that, in 2006, the population of the City and County of Denver was 566,974, making it the 27th most populous U.S. city. The Denver-Aurora Metropolitan Statistical Area had an estimated 2006 population of 2,408,750 and ranked as the 21st most populous U.S. metropolitan statistical area, and the larger Denver-Aurora-Boulder Combined Statistical Area had an estimated 2006 population of 2,927,911 and ranked as the 17th most populous U.S. metropolitan area. The city claims to have the 10th largest central business district in the United States.
6 comments:
I think most people don't put church first is because it is not a priority. When life gets going people put life into priorities and it usually things come before church. Family, work, personal time so often are put before doing something at church. I have been guilty of it many times. I find something more important or what I deem as more important to do. I also think things at church are not done at the same excellence as say work is because of the priorities. You sometimes get put into a situation you might not really want to be in at church and instead of doing your best, we just want to get it over with. Priorities are defintely not easy to change, but I know its something I can work on.
I agree with brandon. I think people are so busy making a living and chasing the american dream that they do not have time to do God's work or they are too tired. Well the problem can also be living a dualistic life, church and God is separate form work and vacation time. I think if we see church not separate from our lives that will help us become more excellent in doing God's work. He blessed us with the job for a reason and it wasn't just to make money to live the american dream!
i think it can go both ways. i think people think they can get away with more at church because there aren't always "bosses" or "supervisors" willing to hold them accountable, and like brandon and tanner said, its viewed as "just church," what people do on sundays between the rest of their life. but i know that some churches go the opposite way as well, focusing only on the product and forgetting about the people and the heart of ministry, and grace. this may just be because i just left a church like that, but people can let church get in the way of God, if you know what i mean. i think God is calling us to excellence no matter what we do, whether that is in the secular workplace, in church, in personal relationships, in forgiveness, in work ethic all together. i think that has to go back to each person's heart, and what they are willing to sacrifice for God. He doesn't want half a heart, or a half-hearted job. so in dealing with this in the future of our church, i think it should be dealt with as a heart issue first, then practically.
and chris, i love the metaphor of redemption thingy.
ya, good thoughts, we should def be careful that church does not turn into a business, but i will say, spelling is a huge deal to me. i am extremely distracted during worship if there are misspelled words on the power point or whatever. i understand sometimes we will have errors, but for the most part i think it really conveys that we care to do the job well. but, that shoudl also keep in mind that sometimes we must minister first, then worry about the official churchthings second. hopefully the two arent that far apart.
I know I am not a future member of the Denver church but if I may comment. This is something I have been thinking about a lot lately because it bugs me a lot. The fact that I do it a lot bugs me the most. What I have been realizing is that when it comes to God, I like to think that I already have all the answers. Well I do this in a lot of areas in my life. But that is how my mind works. Have a problem, find a solution, file it away, and move on. So I approach God like this a lot of times. I might have wondered or struggled over something for awhile but when I feel like I have gained some kind of insight or resolution, I file it away and don't think about it too much more. And sometimes I am quick to do this and don't even give the original matter a lot of thought. So this attitude is refelcted in the way that I serve. I show up and come unprepared because I expect to be able pull out what I need to know in the moment based on what I think I already know. I don't always prepare my heart and my mind, or give myself an opportunity to see new truths or allow God to transform me further. I think that the bottom line is if you are spending quality time with God and allowing Him to continue his redemption in you, it is going to reflect in the way that you serve in His church and in the way that you minister to others. If you are too careless or comfortable in the way that you serve, you are most likely taking the same attitude with God and missing out on a whole lot.
I know I am not a future member of the Denver church but if I may comment. This is something I have been thinking about a lot lately because it bugs me a lot. The fact that I do it a lot bugs me the most. What I have been realizing is that when it comes to God, I like to think that I already have all the answers. Well I do this in a lot of areas in my life. But that is how my mind works. Have a problem, find a solution, file it away, and move on. So I approach God like this a lot of times. I might have wondered or struggled over something for awhile but when I feel like I have gained some kind of insight or resolution, I file it away and don't think about it too much more. And sometimes I am quick to do this and don't even give the original matter a lot of thought. So this attitude is refelcted in the way that I serve. I show up and come unprepared because I expect to be able pull out what I need to know in the moment based on what I think I already know. I don't always prepare my heart and my mind, or give myself an opportunity to see new truths or allow God to transform me further. I think that the bottom line is if you are spending quality time with God and allowing Him to continue his redemption in you, it is going to reflect in the way that you serve in His church and in the way that you minister to others. If you are too careless or comfortable in the way that you serve, you are most likely taking the same attitude with God and missing out on a whole lot.
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